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J-6 Cummins oil filter


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By Drew Waller - Wednesday, October 27, 2010 5:04 PM
I don't have the funds to start working my my White just yet, but I'm still in parts hunting mode none the less.  I'm fairly certain that I have a J-6 Cummins in it.  I bought a 1960 C and J series Cummins service manual and have been reading through it to brush up on what I'm up to under there since my diesel knowledge is fairly limited.

First, where is the serial number on the block?  I'm sure the manual said where to find it, but I don't remember seeing it.

Second, I imagine that I still have the wound wire bag unit style filter on there.  Does anyone make a spin-on filter adapter so that it will be easier to find parts in the future?

I'm led to believe that the Luberfiner is a 750 model, it has a 3-4" tall domed lid with a nut in the center.  I was told the Napa part # for the Donaldson dry-type air filter element (I have it written somewhere around here), and I'd think they'd have the Luberfiner filters too.

As for oil, I'm going to get a 5 gallon bucket of Shell Rotella T 15W-40 and a few quarts extra to have around.  The manual said that the crank case holds 4.5 gallons, and the luberfiner holds a gallon(?).

Last, is there a way to pre-prime the engine since its been sitting for 17 years?

Thanks guys (and gal)!
By Aaron - Wednesday, October 27, 2010 6:44 PM
30 wt engine oil.
By grenfell34 - Wednesday, October 27, 2010 7:06 PM
drew all the j series were bag type filters  the early c series was also bag type but the last of the c serie s had  a fleetguard lf 516  cartrige filter  if you want to convert to the later type[ which i strongly suggest] you will need a head an canister of a late c series that will bolt up to your j block  without any mods.to chech what you have the bag type canister attaches to the filter head with 4 3/8 bolts  the element type attaches with one long 1/2 bolt thru the centre of the canister 
By Drew Waller - Thursday, October 28, 2010 8:34 AM
I'll crawl under the truck tonight to get a picture of the bottom side of the canister to see if it has a bolt going through it.  My '46 IH tractor has the cartridge filter with the bolt in the center, so I know what I'm looking for.  Would the 4 3/8" bolts go from the top side of the filter head down or from the canister side up?

By Eddy Lucast - Thursday, October 28, 2010 9:04 AM
Drew,

webshots photos don't show up unless you have an acount with them and are signed in.

If I click on your links I get a 403 Error, access denied, this site requires you to log in.
By Drew Waller - Thursday, October 28, 2010 11:18 AM
Eddy, I tried the links and got the 403 error as well.  Is a thumbnail that sends me to the webshots page ok?  I'll get some good pictures tonight/tomorrow morning and post them as attachments, that always seems to go better for me.
By glenn akers - Thursday, October 28, 2010 12:40 PM
If you get a full flow filter head to install make sure the oil flow in right and that it has a filter by/pass valve in it. There is a filter that takes place of the bag and spring that has a by/pass valve in it but if i remember right it was good for either flow.The paper element conversion is the one that requires the lines to be connected backwards.This is nspeaking of a 743 or eary 855 engine. But the oil flow has to be correct on a C model also. I have seen alot of engines starved for oil from guys replacing the leaking lines and could not remember how they go.
By Eddy Lucast - Thursday, October 28, 2010 2:54 PM
We love attachments
By Drew Waller - Friday, October 29, 2010 10:22 AM
I got a chance this morning to take a few pictures this morning.  They're not the best because they're from my phone.  Genius me left my good camera in my desk at school.

It has four bolts around the top threaded down towards the ground.  Underneath looking up, I can see the ends of the bolts through the edges of the canister flange.  On the bottom end of the canister there is no nut to take the canister off, so it looks like I have the bag style filter in there.

The engine was rebuilt sometime in the mid/late 80s, could it be possible that there is another type of filter in there other than the wire mesh type?
By glenn akers - Friday, October 29, 2010 1:49 PM
could it be possible that there is another type of filter in there other than the wire mesh type?

Yes that filter can be same as the filter that went inside of the oil pan but the head has a adapter inside that the paper filter goes up in and the adapter looks like trhe end of the spool which the bag goes on. This head will have the in and out turned around for the oil flow. I hate to see guys playing with them that was not around them when used. It is too easy to starve a engine of oil if lines are not connect properly. There is also a filter that will replace the spool and spring bag set up which has by/pass valve inside the filter. This filter would be used on both flows and made by badwin.Dont have a # but some one will know what i am saying.Hope that makes some sense.If this filter has no lines i would not install a different filter in it not knowing the flow on it in relation to the flow of the head.
By Drew Waller - Friday, October 29, 2010 2:37 PM
I looked at the pictures that I have and I couldn't see any lines going to the filter head from the block.  I'll have to pull the access panel off that's just above the fender to get a better look at it (and more pictures).  Once I'm under there, is there a way to tell the difference between the full flow filter head and the bypass filter head, and does the lack of hoses to the filter head mean anything?

I had to do the math, my White is 2.5 times older than me. 
By glenn akers - Friday, October 29, 2010 6:05 PM
I would pull the filter out and find the same replacement and put it back in.You would be safer that way,If it has a bag ask some one how to wind it on to the spool.I did not hear what year it is but if in the 60s it is going to be a paper element.
By Drew Waller - Saturday, October 30, 2010 12:27 PM
My truck is a 1956 model with the original engine.  I looked between the #5 and 6 cylinders, but the I couldn't see the data plate.  I hope I was just wasn't looking hard enough and it wasn't knocked off when the engine was rebuilt.

I got poking around and found this part number for the Luberfiner filter #2122, I still can't find the paper that has the air filter number from Napa on it.  Its the passenger side mounted Donaldson air cleaner.  I'm also going to pick up a spin-on type fuel filter to cut down on the mess and make it easier to find filters.

Glenn, what about a LF502 filter?  It seems that Cummins/Fleetguard still makes them.  Also what about the Fleetguard conversion kit #3300923S?  It says that its a "spin-on full flow adaptor for Cummins engines 1968 and before."  Would that work with my filter head (although I doubt it)?

http://www.cumminsfiltration.com/pdfs/product_lit/americas_brochures/service_parts.pdf

The Cummins dealership isn't too far from me, I could take my service manual and see if they have anything on file.
By Eddy Lucast - Saturday, October 30, 2010 1:50 PM
Found This,

These descriptions came straight from a Luber-Finer 750 application guide.

The 51750 is a Luber-Finer 3845 and is called a Fleetpak. It can be used with all types of oils, including industrial fluid. Its features are controlled media density for high efficiency and long life.

The 51751 is a Luber-Finer 2122 called the Imperial II. It is the higher efficiency version of the 3845. It is to be used with detergent type HD oil. Its features are that it removes fine contaminants without affecting additives. The 2122 is recommended for extended maintenance schedules.

The reason the 2122 is the high efficiency version is due to the way the media is placed into the element housing. The 2122's media is pressed into that housing while the 3845 media is just laid in the element housing.
By glenn akers - Saturday, October 30, 2010 2:49 PM
Drew i read your question in your first post and no you can not put a screw on filter on the head.The adaper you are looking at is the one which the can is held on with one center bolt.
By Drew Waller - Saturday, October 30, 2010 4:25 PM
The more and more I read on this, this bag unit filter is going to be a pain to deal with.  Even winding it sounds tedious if you go by the manual's directions.  I know of another White 9000TD that is close to me in a junkyard.  Last time I was there I looked at it and it has the J/C Cummins engine, maybe I could have lady luck on my side and it will have the single bolt type filter.  Then I could grab the canister and head to put on my truck, and use the Cummins spin on adapter to boot.

I talked to Dad and he agreed to help me pull the access panel and the oil filter off of the truck Friday.  I'll take plenty of pictures and hopefully no surprises are hiding in there.
By glenn akers - Saturday, October 30, 2010 10:26 PM
Here is the way to look at this is how many times will you change the filter any way? May be better off leaveing it along. I have and others changed the bag on many yeARS AGO AND ITS NOT THAT BIG OF A DEAL. jUST FOLLOW THE MANUAL AND WHEN YOU HOW IT WOUND UP BACK THE WOUND OFF HALF A TURN..tHE GASKEST MAYBE HARD TO FIND ALSO.
By Drew Waller - Sunday, October 31, 2010 9:35 AM
I how no idea how many times I'll have to change the oil filter in the life of the truck.  Once its restored I'm planning on using it quite a bit.  I'd like to start an antique tractor restoration company to keep me busy and out of trouble, and the White will be the tractor hauler.  My IH weighs right at 6000 lbs and its almost too much for my Chevy to pull.  The White 4000/9000 owners manual Dan Aldrich sent me says every 4000 miles, but it might take a year or two to get that many miles on the truck at a time, unless I drive to the National Convention or one of the farther shows from me (Winchester, Macungie, or the White Bash).

You're right, it does sound easier to unwind and wind now that I've read it a 4th time.  Once its wound up, I back it off half a turn and the case will keep it from unwinding further?

I looked at the Fleetguard catalog and they have #153528S for the filter case to head gasket for JC engines, #128801S and #132484S used with the LF502 flat gasket but it doesn't have a picture for those, #169802S used with the LF502 cover gasket (no picture), #251152S bypass spring for the ball located in the bottom of the shell.  I'll call the Cumins dealership and see if they have any of these in stock, but I know my wallet will probably be hurting once I get off of the phone with them.  I'll also have to get a #101853S gasket for the Luberfiner lid.

Is there anything special to do to change the Luberfiner filter and should I pre-fill it before I put the lid back on?  As you can tell, I've never changed one of these either so its all pretty new to me.

Thanks again for all of your help!
By glenn akers - Sunday, October 31, 2010 1:22 PM
Drew Waller (10/31/2010)
I how no idea how many times I'll have to change the oil filter in the life of the truck.  Once its restored I'm planning on using it quite a bit.  I'd like to start an antique tractor restoration company to keep me busy and out of trouble, and the White will be the tractor hauler.  My IH weighs right at 6000 lbs and its almost too much for my Chevy to pull.  The White 4000/9000 owners manual Dan Aldrich sent me says every 4000 miles, but it might take a year or two to get that many miles on the truck at a time, unless I drive to the National Convention or one of the farther shows from me (Winchester, Macungie, or the White Bash).

You're right, it does sound easier to unwind and wind now that I've read it a 4th time.  Once its wound up, I back it off half a turn and the case will keep it from unwinding further?

I looked at the Fleetguard catalog and they have #153528S for the filter case to head gasket for JC engines, #128801S and #132484S used with the LF502 flat gasket but it doesn't have a picture for those, #169802S used with the LF502 cover gasket (no picture), #251152S bypass spring for the ball located in the bottom of the shell.  I'll call the Cumins dealership and see if they have any of these in stock, but I know my wallet will probably be hurting once I get off of the phone with them.  I'll also have to get a #101853S gasket for the Luberfiner lid.

Is there anything special to do to change the Luberfiner filter and should I pre-fill it before I put the lid back on?  As you can tell, I've never changed one of these either so its all pretty new to me.

Thanks again for all of your help!
                 The luberfiner does not need to be prfilled but should be bleed thru the plug some were. When warm it should be warm to your hand. On the full flow unwind it is left loose so oil can flow thru it. But if left tight oil is restricted.It then goes around the bag instead of thru it.
By wayne graham - Sunday, October 31, 2010 1:35 PM
Drew, When you buy luberfiner 750 get a new rubber for the lid and you should be able to re-use it several times. just pay attention to the lock band before you remove it and go back the same . when bolts are just snug tap the ring with soft hammer lightly to make sure it is seated properly and then tighten blts evenly. You probably already know all this but just in case. You did ask a bunch of old men for advice. HA-HA. Wayne
By Drew Waller - Sunday, October 31, 2010 2:07 PM
Thanks Wayne, I have a whole list of gaskets that I'll be asking the parts guy about and that one is at the top just after the filter. 

Thanks Glenn, changing the filter doesn't sound as daunting now as it did before.

You fellas aren't old, just a lot wiser and full of advise.  Its why this forum is the first place I come to with truck questions if my dad or grandpaw don't have the answer first.
By Drew Waller - Monday, November 01, 2010 8:42 AM
I found this scouring ebay for any good deals: 1959 Cummins J, JF, and JN Diesel Engine Parts Manual

I know it would be handy to have around and make future parts buying a lot easier.  Is that a fair price for a copy?
By Wolfcreek_Steve - Monday, November 01, 2010 6:14 PM
I think that is an OK price. Those manuals are probably not real common anymore. It would be money well spent.
By Drew Waller - Tuesday, November 02, 2010 11:38 AM
I called the parts desk at the Cummins dealership in Charlotte and the guy there was very helpful and knew what type of engine I was talking about with just the J-6 designation.  For future reference for anyone else looking here are some part numbers, descriptions and prices as of Nov. 2nd, 2010:

All numbers are Cummins/Fleetguard part numbers.
Bag type filter element - LF502 - $9.30
Filter case to head gasket - #153528S - $1.74
Gasket kit (he didn't say what all is in it) - #128801S - $1.15
Gasket kit (he didn't say what was in this one either) - # 169802S - $1.80

Luberfiner 750 filter element - LF750D - $9.34
Luberfiner 750 lid gasket - #101853S - $3.43

For anyone with a White (I don't know what other makes used this air cleaner) that has a Donaldson dry element air cleaner #860393, the filter is Napa P/N 2260 and it is $41.12.

They had all of the parts in stock, or could get one (or more for a few of them) from the warehouse that is close by within a day or two.  IIRC, he said that they have 5 or 6 LF502's in stock and 9 of the case gaskets, I might have to buy a couple extra and put them up for a rainy day.

It looks like I'll be making a trip down there within the next month or so to start collecting all the parts I need to get the old girl going.  I also want to thank all of you for your help, your knowledge is literally invaluable to me!
By Eddy Lucast - Wednesday, November 03, 2010 1:11 AM
I look at the price of parts books as "How many wrong parts do I have to buy before the book pays for its self".
By Drew Waller - Wednesday, November 03, 2010 6:50 AM
That's a good way to look at it Eddy.  Its about 40 miles one way for me to get to the Cummins dealership, so one wrong part would justify the book in gas alone having to drive 160 miles from start to coming back home with the correct part.  I just bought myself a copy by the way!

I also found a 1956 PT fuel pump manual on there too, I'll probably pick that one up as well.
By pete - Sunday, November 07, 2010 6:47 AM
My 250 has a horizontally mounted oil filter that was origionally the bag type.Years ago i bought a cartrige with a spring on it that replaced the bag ,So you could have cartridge in it that fits in the housing for the bag like mine .If  it was rebuilt in the 80's it might very well have been changed.The only sure way is take it off and look.
By Drew Waller - Sunday, November 07, 2010 9:26 AM
Thanks Pete, I'll pull the housing off next weekend, I'm about out of time for this weekend to work on anything.  Once its off I'll get several pictures and add to this thread, hopefully if its been changed over the new cartridge will have a part number stamped on it.

Steve Rosemond told me at the Colfax show that he remembers Lester Brown himself telling him that my White has a C-160 in it.  From the J/C service manual the only major difference I've been able to find is piston bores and the number of valves depending on which J and C engine you're comparing.  So all of the parts I've found should cross over regardless of series.